TXDERBY wrote:the cook wrote:you'd think after gettin' beat twice, a man would just say "I think them boys are better than me" and move on
What we shared with you ended up on our competitors’ team while you were supposedly a ZE team member. .....
.... In fact the real derby experts told our team to go with rubber but you convinced us in 1998 to go with AEND urethane (with disastrous results for our team on an amazing car driven by one of the best drivers in derby history). Interesting to note that Sigma Nu come out with many new AEND tires in 1998 that they were unable to previously obtain due to your poor relationship with Neal at AEND.
TXDERBY wrote:the cook wrote:you'd think after gettin' beat twice, a man would just say "I think them boys are better than me" and move on
What we shared with you ended up on our competitors’ team...
Nothing from ZE has ever been used on our derby cars. AEND wheels that are an agreed to output of the relationship between you and Duane are used by the zoo in practice for the cmu race.
On the other hand, one cannot help but wonder how SDC ended up on white AEND tires on ZE rims in the 2009 CMU race. At the time Duane was helping you develop the rubber wheels you won with. The CMU race was a month before you knew I was doing derby and the SDC deal must have been done several months prior to that to allow for manufacturing and practice time. If anything, the flow of information and materials happened early and in the other direction.
If you think I " took "MPC from you, then you are mistaken. I have tried to correct this in the past but clearly you are not interested in understanding the timeline of how I ended up with MPC.
Duane did not give me MPC as a source. I got the MPC contact info from my original derby team in late summer 2008 (the guy I helped to 4th place in 2009, along with helping Mark O to 3rd place). This was before I had even decided to make any wheels. I was busy testing his AEND green wheels vs. treated xootrs and trying to get my head around this ultimate speed race by studying it's history.
This teammate, Mr Wargo, talked a lot about wanting to make new wheels. He too wanted rubber but that was outside of my budget at the time Eventually, we hatched a plan for some new wheels on Xootr rims.. MPC seemed the obvious choice for the tires as their stuff had done well at cmu in 2008. So, in the fall of 2008, I started a lengthy development process that included a series of dual layer wheels, single layer wheels, and later included smaller diameter wheels. Each of these was done with a mix of compounds, durometer, and dimensions. This work ultimately resulted in the 6 inch wheels we used in the 2009 derby and larger Xootr sized wheels used at CMU that same year.. These same little wheels have also run in 2010 and 2011 by other teams at derby, but have long since been surpassed by our newer stuff in terms of speed at Akron. Plenty safe too, despite all the noise you made about them.
My understanding is that you talked to (or emailed) MPC but never actually made any wheels with them prior to the 2009 derby race. You 'thinking' about them vs. my investment in time, effort, and $$ to develop and prove my designs with MPC tires, are 2 different things entirely.
I have not raced MPC stuff again in derby. I do continue to use a single MPC wheel in my testing as a reference wheel. Also, I did order one more batch of wheels from MPC after the 2009 race, based on Xootr rims.. The resulting wheels were not up to the same high quality of prior MPC orders and they were shelved. That is the sum of my MPC experience.
Or,
You could you be talking about the rubber formula he helped you develop and use in 2009. You would be wrong again, His 2010 and 2011 formulas are not the same as each other and not the same as the 09 formula. they are not even close.
I suspect your 'proof' of our team using ZE stuff is a handful of misleading graphs pilfered from my flicker account and a bogus email string you may have intercepted. By now, you should have realized that there are no 8 inch pneumatic wheels, there is no rubber-urethane hybrid, we have no dual layer AEND wheels, Mr Ocho is a myth, and we had no 'ZE rubber' wheels. We would be fools to post meaningful results. These bogus test results were only placed there (much like the bogus graph of inertia vs rolling resistance vs diameter and the bogus photos of our "new" wheels) to mess with you, just like the orange car noses last year.
I am not sure what you and Duane were discussing in 1998, being that it was 6 years before the ultimate speed race began and 10 years before he became involved with ZE.
However, in 2008, Duane's end of the bargain with ZE was to (re)gain access to the aend urethane that we had been running at CMU over the prior 5+ years (not on xootr rims) by using ZE as an intermediary. We had lost access to aend as a supplier due to an ugly indecent involving a a lost tire mold and set of lost rims. AEND wheels work well at CMU for both practice and the race and the zoo has had a bunch of them on hand starting in 2008. The wheels were paid for and the zoo's use of them should not be all that remarkable.
Do you seriously believe that Duane led you astray in 2008? He helped you with his best effort in 2008 and 2009. Blaming him because rubber cannot be molded in an open pour urethane mold is silly. He gave you the best from what he had to work with. His hands were tied in 2008 as the wheels could not be properly shaped due to how the car fit on the gage. The juiced pka wheels would have still beaten you but you could have been closer had a flatter profile been possible. In 2009 he helped ZE to a great win. He provided the cmu rubber tire samples that were reverse engineered, and was the primary cook on your tire formula. He prepped your wheels and developed/ran the juice program that brought you the win. he prepped wheels that were rented to other cars but did not see any of the $$$ that resulted from his efforts.
Duane appears to be a valuable asset for any team, having won the past 3 years and having broken the track record 5 out of the past 6 times it was broken (vs. your 1 time and my 4). His tires on my rims on Mark's car with Sheri driving has resulted in the first repeat winner in AA ultimate (quite a feat) the 6 fastest runs in derby history.
We posted the results. My post here was very very brief. If that was rubbing it in your face, then you need to toughen up. You responded with a rash of should have - would haves in an attempt to belittle our results ( rather than focus on your win in another race) and a host of personal attacks. The above is the last energy I will waste on you. I am done discussing this.
